Star showers in Bollywood

July 4, 2016

Guest article by DP Rangan

(Full Moon evokes poetry, beauty and romance.  One would think its converse, Dark Moon, must be very depressing.   But think again.  That is the time when the stars come out in full glory. As with the moon, stars, too, have evoked wonder, admiration and myths. We see our seven ancient great sages in the stars, known as Saptarshi. When a dear one passes away, we imagine he/she has become one of the stars in the sky.  Bollywood has also been inspired to create ‘Taare/Sitaare’ songs in great numbers. A Full Moon Night is followed 15 days later by the Dark Moon, or Amavasya, according to our Almanac.  No sooner had we been satiated by the Bollywood’s romance with the Moon, DP Rangan was ready with his ‘stars’ post.  On my suggestion he has cut out a great deal of astronomical details.  Having read his full article I can say he is not an amateur astronomer.  Mr Rangan has diligently covered every year of the 50s with some great selection of songs.  ‘Moon’ came on a Full Moon Day.  Today is Dark Moon, the best time to enjoy Mr Rangan’s dalliance with ‘taare’ and ‘sitaare’. Thank you Mr Rangan. – AK)

Chaand taareAnyone could jump to a conclusion that this post has something to do with the glittering actors of filmdom, particularly female of the species, popularly known as stars or actress. Such is not my intention. I will commence with my personal experience as a boy.

My father was an amateur astronomer and constructed a telescope with the lenses I filched from the school laboratory where they were lying in a neglected condition. A pair of a long focal concave lens and a discarded convex eye piece of microscope were enough for the purpose. As a ten year old, I enjoyed hours of watching the skies in the night lying down on the ground. It was a thrilling experience to see moon with craters, Mars with two moons, Jupiter with four moons and the rings of Saturn. I was completely bitten by the bug and am a keen star gazer even today and have gobbled up a lot of literature on the subject. I once had an occasion to travel through an open plateau in Maharashtra. I deliberately chose to travel on a New Moon day across all night with a well-bribed driver, and the spectacle of dark sky unfolding before me with millions of stars is far ever ingrained in my memory. People living in metropolis have no such opportunity as the sky is filled with reflected light from below which obscures everything. One has to wish for a total blackout to see the sky miracle.

A star-spangled sky at dark nights is a wonder and one would be lost in admiration at the handiwork of God. The Milky Way, the galaxy in which solar system is located in one of its spiral arms, stretches as a white band across the skies, known as Akash Ganga, and is visible from April to October. It is so densely packed with stars, that they cannot be seen individually and the entire stretch across the sky looks like a white river. In my boyhood days, small towns used to be sparsely lighted at night and the sky would be visible as a dark arena with stars of all magnitude blinking in unison and the planets as Jupiter, Mars, Saturn travelling from east to west. Planets do not blink at all and can be easily identified. In fact the very name planet is derived from Greek where it means wanderer. Venus and Mercury rise in the east as morning star or in the west as evening star and climb up to a certain height in the sky and then go down. Mercury is very difficult to spot as it is close to the sun and concealed in its glare. It is faintly visible just before sunrise or immediately after sunset. Uranus, Neptune and dethroned Pluto are not visible to the naked sky. Venus is the brightest object in the sky and is even visible in day time provided one can pinpoint its location. Mars will appear as a reddish body.

Our ancestors were well versed in the science of astronomy and could predict solar and lunar eclipses very accurately. Tablets of the ancient Sumerian civilization contains data on eclipses with future calendars of them. Egyptian pyramids and Mayan sun temples were closely linked to the star system around us. There is a steady build up of knowledge of astronomical bodies since long and instruments revolving in space in dust free conditions far above the earth like Hubble Space Telescope launched in 1990 have immensely added to our knowledge of universe. Astrophysics is a major branch of study these days and radio telescopes have enabled us to explore further back in time by studying receding galaxies at more than 12 billion light years away.

Origin of the universe is linked to the Big Bang Theory. The entire material of the universe was packed into an intensely hot and dense point called Singularity about 13.8 billion years ago. There was a sudden explosion, and accelerated expansion took place. Books have been written to describe further events in duration of seconds. I do not want to dwell upon them here as it is too technical in nature. Initially after cooling due to expansion, sub-atomic particles were created as proton, electron and neutron. Later, these coalesced to form elementary elements as hydrogen, helium and lithium. Even today the interstellar gases are filled with these elements. Due to gravitational pull, areas of local hot dense gases started contracting and heating up and led to the formation of galaxies and stars thereon. Heavier elements were formed within the giant hot star interiors and when these imploded as supernova, the star material was dispersed far and wide and secondary stars with heavier elements were born. Still heavier elements were synthesized and repetition of this process has led to the present day range of elements from hydrogen to uranium and beyond. Observational evidence as predominance of light elements and constant cosmic background radiation discovered in 1965 lend support to this theory. In 1929, Edward Hubble observed galaxies retreating from one another, implying steady expansion of universe over time. This was known as Red Shift, i.e. spectroscopic analysis of radiation from these bodies showed in the red band of light.

Our galaxy is a barred spiral one and has two major spiral arms and a few minor ones. It is 100,000 light years across and contains more than 400 billion stars. It is very difficult to assess the sheer spread of the galaxy when one light year is equal to 9460.8 billion kilometres (1 light year = the distance travelled by light in a year at a speed of 300000 kilometres per second). It is part of a local group of around 50 galaxies surrounded by globular cluster and irregular galaxy called Magellanic Cloud, visible from the southern hemisphere and named in honour of Captain Magellan of Spain, the first sailor to circumnavigate the globe in a sail ship and passing through the straits around Cape Horn, extreme southern tip of South America (1519-22) though he did not survive through the epic journey.

Our Sun is 25000 light years from the centre of the galaxy and located in a minor arm or spur called Orion Arm. A thick blanket of stellar dust further obscures the galactic centre saving our solar system from harmful radiation. Our location is a very fortunate one with sparsely populated stars in the neighbourhood ensuring that nights stay dark. Otherwise even night would have looked like day with combined light from densely packed cluster of stars in the sky as in the galactic centre. Our Sun is an average-sized star with a long life and at present in its steady state. We have at least another billion years to run before life will vanish from earth due to a bulging and heated up sun. Here is an imaginary picture of our galaxy as would be visible if viewed from outside and the position of the sun in it.

Milky Way

I have given enough material for people to be yawning while reading through or getting their interest whipped up to look for more information on the subject. Let me now turn attention to the musical aspect. Our heroes and heroines seem to have been fascinated with blinking heavenly objects visible at night that have stimulated them into a singing mood. Music directors have created lilting and exhilarating songs penned by great lyricists. I will list a few of them below for the enjoyment of the blog followers, whose patience has been sorely tested by me.

1. Abhi sham aayegi nikalenge taare by Lata Mangeshkar from Samadhi (1950), lyrics Rajendra Krishna, music C Ramchandra

Ashok Kumar and Nalini Jaywant are the main stars with other actors  as Shyam, Sandhya. The story is woven around battlefields of Burma during the closing stages of the 2nd World War. The film is a tragedy with Ashok Kumar crawling into India on Burma border and expiring. Nalini Jaywant laments that her love will not be there to greet her in the evening and Ashok Kumar is taking leave of her. It is a tender scene and the song reflects it. Another song which was on the lips of everyone in those days is Gore gore o banke chhore by Lata Mangeshkar and Amirbai Karnataki. A crude copy of the same was sung by the great Carnatic musician M L Vasanthakumari in the film Oor Iravu in Tamil.

2. Tara toote duniya dekhe by Mukesh from Malhar (1951), lyrics Indeevar, music Roshan

The film was produced by Mukesh. Some of the actors are Arjun Bakshi, Shammi, Moti Sagar and Sonali Devi. Roshan in his ascendency phase gave very good music and all songs were hits. Here Mukesh is singing this song in his usual voice of pathos.

3. Dil-e-beqarar so jaa by Talat Mahmood & Lata Mangeshkar from Raagrang (1952), lyrics Kaifi Irfani, music Roshan

Ashok Kumar and Geeta Bali are the main characters in this film with others as Sunder, Madan Puri, Ruma Devi. A very lovely duet brought out by Roshan. Reference to ‘sitare’ is only one line.

4. Ae chand sitaron by Talat Mahmood from Daayera (1953), lyrics Kaif Bhopali, music Jamal Sen

This film deals with the travails of a young woman (Meena Kumari) married to an old man and the resulting incompatibility. Presence of a young man (Nasir Khan, brother of Dilip Kumar) adds to her ire and in the end she commits suicide. Kamal Amrohi is the producer. He was 15 years senior to Meena Kumari whom he married just before the film was started. In a way it could be called biographic. It was a tragedy of marriage for the great actress and affected her subsequent life very badly. Jamal Sen gave wonderful tunes and Mubarak Begum by her singing made them immortal. This song by the crooner Talat Mahmood is an all time great by him.

5. Gaya andhera hua ujara by Talat Mahmood and Lata Mangeshkar from Subah ka Tara (1954), lyrics Noor Lakhanavi, music C Ramchandra

A Shantaram production with Pradeep Kumar and Jayashree as main actors. He tried to tackle a grave social problem of rehabilitation of girl widow. This is a typical C Ramchandra song with his easily identifiable background music. Hero and heroine travelling in a train are gazing at the morning stars and singing this song of hope, very pleasing to the ears.

6. Doob gaye aakash ke tare by Talat Mahmood from Angaarey (1954), lyrics Sahir Ludyanvi, music S.D. Burman

A Nasir Khan and Nargis starrer with the villain Pran, the story revolves around love of a princess with a commoner and the attempt of the irate father King to scuttle it. I have not seen the movie but I presume it would have had a happy ending. In case it ends as a tragedy my apology to the readers for my presumption. S D Burman has composed a soulful smooth flowing song in the silken voice of Talat Mahmood.

7. Na ye chand hoga na taare rahenge by Kauser Parveen, Geeta Dutt and Hemant Kumar from Sassi (1956)/Shart (1954), lyrics S.H. Behari, music Hemant Kumar

Deepak, Shyama, Shashikala, I S Johar are the major actors. All the three versions of the song are combined here. It starts with one rendered by Kauser Parveeen and ends with that of Hemant Kumar. Parveen version is from the Pakistani film Sassi (1956). The song is well known for all serious music lovers of the old songs.

8. Sitaaron ki mehfil by Lata Mangeshkar from Uran Khatola (1955), lyrics Shakeel Badauni, music Naushad

Dilip Kumar, Nimmi and Suryakumari are the principal actors. The story line has been described in the post “Tonga in Tinsel World”. Naushad’s own production, and the music by him is par excellence and all songs will be hits for ever. Lata Mangeshkar has brought out the yearning of Nimmi for Dilip Kumar by her tone of rendition of the song.

9. Kahan le chale ho by Lata Mangeshkar and chorus from Durgesh Nandini (1956), lyrics Rajendra Krishna, music Hemant Kumar

A panoply of actors – Pradeep Kumar, Bina Rai, Ajit, Nalini Jaywant, Nigar Sultana and I S Johar – grace this film. This song appears to be a dream sequence by Bina Rai in which Pradeep Kumar also appears. A lovely piece by Hemant Kumar which has not lost its appeal even now.

10. Teri chamakatee ankhon ke aaghe by Lata Mangeshkar and Talat Mahmood from Chhote Babu (1957), lyrics Indeevar, music Madan Mohan

Shekar and Nimmi are the main stars of this social drama. Madan Mohan gave some outstanding music for B grade movies. He didn’t get commercial success commensurate with his status. In Chhote Babu, too, his music rses over the film. Well sung by Talat Mahmood and Lata Mangeshkar, this is a free flowing tune from the maestro.

11. Taaron ki zuban par hai mohabbat ki kahani by Lata Mangeshkar and Mohammad Rafi from Nausherwan-e-Aadil (1957), lyrics Parvez Shamshi, music C Ramchandra

Raj Kumar and Mala Sinha are the leading pair in the film directed by Sohrab Modi. This film dealing with the conflict of religion, ends in a tragedy. The Muslim prince is in love with a girl who practices Christian faith in secret. The stern father disapproves of the alliance. C Ramchandra as usual has given a very good music.

12. Tim tim tim taaron ke deep jale by Talat Mahmood & Lata Mangeshkar from Mausi (1958), lyrics Bharat Vyas, music Vasant Desai

A very ordinary film with second string actors, it was redeemed to some extent by the good music of Vasant Desai and this is one of the good duets. Another notable song is a solo by Lata Mangeshkar – Meri godi mein gopala.

13. Sitaare raah takte by Lata Mangeshkar from Black Cat (1959), lyrics Jan Nisar Akhtar, music N Datta

Balraj Sahni, Minoo Mumtaz, Johnny Walker act in this film. It appears to be an average film. N Datta has given ever enduring songs and this is one of the best songs from this film sung by the great Lata Mangeshkar in her dulcet voice.

14. Tim tim karke taare by Lata Mangeshkar from Chirag Kahan Roshni Kahan (1959), lyrics Prem Dhawan, music Ravi

A serious social drama with Rajendrar Kumar and Meena Kumari in lead roles. Widowed Meena Kumari delivers a still-born baby in the hospital. Dr Rajendra Kumar substitutes his own new born boy as his wife had died in child birth. Meena Kumari does not know this. Rajendra Kumar frequently visits her house to have a look at his child much to her discomfiture. The mother-in-law of Meena Kumari does not approve of this frequent visit and mistakes it as his passion for his widowed daughter-in-law. Ultimately all the issues are resolved. This song has a happy and sad version. Sad version is sung by Meena Kumari when the child on being proved as not her own is taken away by Rajendra Kumar. A typical song from Ravi, it is a good lullaby.

I request the blog followers to excuse me for the long introduction. I had to do to bring forth my ideas about the science of astronomy. I am more than an amateur in this field and have visited several observatories in USA and have been encouraged by the authorities there to spend as much time as I could to view heavenly objects. What a feast for my eyes and total fulfilment of my childhood dreams. I cut out a lot of technical stuff and attempted to present a simple essay on the subject. I added an illustration to ensure people who have the patience to read through it also get a visual effect. Please feel free to offer your frank comments, including anything that you do not like about my writing.

{ 118 comments… read them below or add one }

1 Ashok M Vaishnav July 4, 2016 at 9:46 am

WOW! Another great connect of HF songs with the worldly matter.

Look forward to other friends to sprinkle more STARs and add to the glory of our sky as presented by Shri D P Rangan.

2 Subodh Agrawal July 4, 2016 at 11:46 am

Thank you Mr Rangan for a very learned article and a wonderful selection of songs. As always happens on SoY, some of the songs are new for me. I will enjoy them at leisure.

3 Mahesh July 4, 2016 at 11:51 am

A very apt song is from Jal bin machli nritya bin bijli (1971) sung by Mukesh.

“taron mein sajke apne suraj se milne”

A good post indeed. Will come up with a few more later.

4 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 4, 2016 at 12:04 pm

A very informative article and selected songs to match the theme.
Just one point. Sandhya never acted in film Samaadhi-50. She entered Hindi films only in 1952. As far as I know she acted only in films of Shantaram,in Hindi.

5 Khyati Bhatt July 4, 2016 at 12:27 pm

Very unusual topic but connected very interestingly with the Hindi Cinema. I love the selection of songs and of course the info on the Galaxy matters. I am not even an amateur astronomer but my son is into astronomy and during his high school years I have taken him to many monthly “Star Gazing parties” organized by the local chapter of Astronomical Society with whom he was affiliated. Looking at the Galaxies and meteor shower with the naked eye in the Arizona dessert, Sequoia National Park and in Colorado was truly an amazing experience for me! We still use his telescope whenever we travel in the dessert areas.
Thank you Ranganji and AKji for the wonderful post.

6 Dinesh K Jain July 4, 2016 at 12:39 pm

Rangan ji – and of course AK ji,

What a wonderful theme, an essay on the subject to exceed it, and a superlative collection of songs to match. Thank you very much. Enjoyed thoroughly.

7 ksbhatia July 4, 2016 at 1:24 pm

DP Rangan ji;
A superlative multi dimensional article very well supported by equally amazing songs ….a real supplement to chanda theme . Hope this would be as active as Moon theme.

Your technical details reminds me of my association with ISRO and USGS where i had a chance to interact with these organisation in relation to maping of the flood plains , pre and post flooding details, using sattelite imageries . A visit to NASA museum at Washington was another wonderful experience to look at the actual galaxy presentation true to its at present details . My training at USGS at Denver gave me enough insight to the indepth studies involving astro data . Other subject of interest was Geology . The training helped me making me Member of both USGS [United States Geological Survey] and AGU [ American Geophysical Union ] in addition to awarding Certificate of Merit .

Of all the songs listed my choice of best song goes to Uran Khatola song…..Sitaroan ki mehfil sazi tum na aaye….A wonderful sad song very well composed and nicely rendered by LATA ji. There is one more of taare songs in this film which I am posting at present.

Dooba Taara umeedoan ka sahara…..Lata…Udan Khatola….Naushad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39Y1pz6O7hk

8 Mohan Lal July 4, 2016 at 2:54 pm

New Delhi, 4 July 2016.

One song which could have been included in the above list of 14 beautiful songs is the following:

Song: Taron bhari raat hai per tu nahin ye zindagi kya hai
Singer artitsts: Mohammad Rafi & Asha Bhoslé
Lyricist: DN Madhok / Shakeel
Music Director: Ghulam Mohammad.
Film: Kajal (1948)

Your comments please as well as of other enthusiasts.

Mohan Lal

9 Shalini July 4, 2016 at 4:43 pm

What a glittering selection of songs! Love almost all of them. Here are a few of my twinkling favorites:

Yeh chand yeh sitaaren (Halaku)

Soch ke yeh gagan jhoome (Jyoti)

Sitaaron aaj to hum bhi (Rakhi)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-tMU21u25I
Kahin se shaam hote hi, sitaaren aa hi jaate hain (Shatranj)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJezql2cBPg

10 Shalini July 4, 2016 at 4:47 pm

Oops, hit submit too quickly. Would be helpful if I actually provided links for the first two songs! 🙂

Yeh chand yeh sitaaren
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wP2znYhyjs

Soch ke yeh gagan jhoome
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFuFI3FFN3M

11 D P Rangan July 4, 2016 at 8:44 pm

AK
Thank you for granting me imprimatur for this post. Your wonderful diction in writing the introduction is greatly appreciated. You can seriously think of writing foreward to books as a serious pursuit. Your choice of date to publish this is also well thought out.

I am leaving for Chicago just now and will thank all the patrons after I return in 2 days. Here is a collective thanks for all the commentators to start with.

12 N Venktaraman July 5, 2016 at 9:34 pm

Rangan ji,
Your current write-up, giving a fair idea about astronomy, is well presented and interesting. Earlier, with two erudite articles on horses and horse drawn carriages you had completely floored us. And with another scholarly article on stars, preceded by one on the moon, our spiirts are soaring higher and higher. Now, it seems like the sky’s the limit. You can do anything you set your mind to. Hats off Rangan ji for yet another wonderful post.
The selection of songs was excellent and loved listening to the songs especially the songs Ae chand sitaron, Sitaare raah takte etc. Some of the songs were new for me like
Tara Tute, Duniya Dekhen, Dekha Na Kisi Ne Dil Tut Gaya
Dekha Na Kisi Ne Dil Tut Gaya
Kitane Hi Tare Tute, Hoga Na Kabhi Andhiyara
Asman Par Bahot Hai Tare, Dil Tha Ek Hamara

As you have mentioned, our galaxy contains more than 400 billion stars. Dile beqaraar soja, was also good and was new to me. If the song ,Dub gaye aakash ke tare, jake naa tum aaye takte takte naina hare, jake naa tum aaye, has a melancholic touch , Gaya andhera hua ujara,another nice song, brings in air of hope, lifts our spirits.

Gayii udaasii raunak chhaayii, roshanii ab jiivan mein aayii
hansii khushii kaa chhedo taraanaa, naach uthe man jhuume zamaanaa
samaa suhaanaa pyaaraa pyaaraa, chamakaa chamakaa subah kaa taaraa …

As regards the song, Na ye chand hoga na taare rahenge, Arun ji in one of his well-researched articles in ‘Atul Song A Day’ had provided the following information about this song.

“During the period 1946-47, many films remained incomplete or unreleased as their producers migrated to Pakistan. In few cases due to Director or composer also, films were not completed, though in most cases and where the producer was strong and in India, a replacement ensured completion of those films.
One such unreleased film was “SASSI” in the late 40s. This was a love story of Sassi and Punnu. Not much information is available on why this film was not released, but songs were recorded for this movie. Most songs were not available, but one song was discovered, thanks to the efforts of Shri Girdharilal ji Vishwakarma ji and Dr. Surjit Singh ji (who made it available on his site). The Music director of this film was G.A.Chishti, who migrated to Pakistan in 1949. Though he was not a successful or known composer in India, he became a Legend in Pakistan and was extremely successful and respected too.
The song which he composed for the film “Sassi” was so melodious that after going to Pakistan, G A Chishti used the same song-Lyrics and tune- in his film Sassi-1954 which was made in Pakistan with almost the same cast, since most of the cast had also migrated to Pakistan. However, the song was sung in that Pakistani film by Kausar Parveen, sister of Film’s Heroine Asha Posley. Coincidence was that in a film made in 1954 in India-Shart- composer Hemant Kumar also used this tune and Lyrics in a song sung by Geeta Dutt and Himself in 2 parts. The song became hit in India as well as Pakistan.”

But Surjit Singh ji (who made the song available on his site, as per Arun ji) in his comments says
“In a book on film music published in Pakistan, there is an interview in which Chishti said that he asked Hemant Kumar’s permission to use the song Na ye Chang Hoga in Sassi 1954.’ (Atul Song A Day)

But Arun ji finally puts a seal with his rejoinder
“All the points made in the above post are correct, except probably that the song posted here is sung by Kausar Parveen and NOT Asha Posley. As I am not very sure, I went by what information I got first.”

However, it should be noted that the lyrics for all the three versions of this song were different, except the mukhda. The lyrics for Sassi were penned by Aziz Merathi and the lyrics for both the versions of Shart was penned by Shamsul Huda Bihari. Arun ji may further enlighten us.

Another interesting observation would like to share here. The date of this post coincides with entry or arrival of Juno (the spacecraft), into the Jupiter’s Orbit. Juno was launched from Cape Canaveral Air Force Station on 5th August 2011 and arrived on 4th July 2016. The voyage to Jupiter has taken almost five years. On 12th August 2013, Juno had traveled half of its journey to Jupiter. The Juno mission, after collection of data providing insight into Jupiter’s origin etc., is set to conclude in February 2018. The spacecraft’s name comes from Greco-Roman mythology. The god Jupiter drew a veil of clouds around himself to hide his mischief, but his wife, the goddess Juno, was able to peer through the clouds and see Jupiter’s true nature.

Ak ji’s brief introduction too was good. His reference to the Saptarshi sages/stars reminds me of an interesting marriage ritual. After the Saptapadi (Seven steps), the groom shows the bride the Arundhati star. Arundhati, the wife of Vashishta (one of the stars of the constellation Saptarishi or Ursa Major), was said to be embodiment of wifely devotion, chastity and conjugal bliss. The groom points to Vashishta and Arundhati, double stars, as the ideal couple symbolizing marital happiness and devotion. Arundhati is also identified with the morning star and also with the star Alcor which forms a double star with Mizar (identified as Sage Vashista) in Ursa Major.

Rangan ji, all the fourteen songs posted by you are from the 50s. I would like to add two songs from the 40s.

Hat gayi lo kaari ghataa chhitak rahe taare by K L Saigal, film Lagan (1941), lyrics Arzoo Lakhnavi, music Rai Chand Boral
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqljkZU-LYM

Chandni Raat Aur Tare Khile hon by K L Saigal and Khursheed, film Bhakta Surdas (1942), lyrics Dina Nath Madhok, music Gyan Dutt
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yg5ee6-LjfM

Thank you once agin Rangan ji and Ak ji.

13 AK July 5, 2016 at 10:13 pm

Venkataramanji,
Thanks a lot for your detailed comments. I am confining myself to Na ye chaand hoga. If GA Chishti had made this tune in 1949, would he have sought Hemant Kumar’s permission or the other way round?

14 ksbhatia July 5, 2016 at 10:55 pm

Venkatraman ji;
Juno’s arrival into Jupiter’s orbit on 4th of July makes it perfect date for celebrations of America’s independence day.
Thanks for posting of vintage songs of the 40’s.
Here are two vintage songs of Khursheed ;

1.Jo hum pe guzarti hai sitaroan se poochhieye….[1940s]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9oExmqNSQTA

2. Jholi bar tare laa de re……Details not available….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXJfiUsHDXs

15 Mahesh July 5, 2016 at 10:58 pm

Regarding the number of stars in the universe, Carl Sagan, the famed cosmologist and astronomer had an excellent analogy in his book Cosmos.

He says a handful of sand picked on a beach has about 10,000 grains and is more than the number of stars we can see with the naked eye on a clear sky. He further says that the total number of stars in the universe is more than all the grains of all the beaches on earth.

Nobody could have simplified it more clearly.

The wiki-page on him gives a detailed info about his works and immense contributions. The Hollywood movie “Contact” 1997 starring Jodie Foster was dedicated to him.

16 Gaddeswarup July 6, 2016 at 3:20 am

May be this too which appeared a few times before ‘ tim tima Tim tare…’ From Har Har Mahadev 1950 https://youtu.be/9qglcAY9j7M

17 Gaddeswarup July 6, 2016 at 3:43 am

I do not know the meaning well enough to know whether this fits “kis tarah bhulega dil unka khyal aaya hua
pyar nahi sakta abhi shishe me daag aaya hua” it was sung by both Noor Jehan and Zohrabai.

18 Siddharth July 6, 2016 at 9:43 am

Ranganji,
Thanks for yet another informative post.
I always wondered if earth had more than 1 moon, it would have been a lovely spectacle and how our poets would relate to that.
With continuing research we shall discover more about the universe which is such a fascinating subject.
As Allama Iqbal has said –

Sitaron se aage jahan aur bhi hain
Abhi ishq ke imtehan aur bhi hain

This couplet was also used in the following song –
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mD35xRhdEkM
Sitaaron Se Aage Jahan Aur Bhi Hai – Meenar – Asha Bhonsle
Music Director: C Ramchandra
Lyricist: Rajinder Krishan

19 AK July 6, 2016 at 10:40 am

KS Bhatiaji,
Thanks a lot for posting the two Khursheed songs. The second one was new to me, though a search in HFGK showed it is from the famous film Bhakta Surdas (1942), music Gyan Dutt. The film was a high point for Khursheed. The first song is from Mumtaz Mahal (1944), music Khemchand Prakash. With a slightly different mukhada, Suman Kalyanpur sang Jo hum pe guzarti hai tanha kise samjhayein in Mohabbat Isko Kahte Hain, music Khayyam.

20 KB July 6, 2016 at 2:11 pm

There is one beauiful song Sitaro aj to hum bhi from Raakhi tuned by Ravi and sung by Asha bhosle which can be a fit inclusion in this.

21 N Venkataraman July 6, 2016 at 3:42 pm

AK ji,
#13
True, obviously such question does come-up. Arun ji replies to a similar query made by Nitin ji (Shah)
“I will repeat. The same film was made again in Pakistan. By the time it was ready, probably, Hemant Kumar had already used this tune in Shart-54. That is why,G A Chisti asked for his permission.”
Arun ji may have something more to say on this.

Bhatia ji,
Thanks for posting the two vintage gems of Kursheed. Thanks Ak ji for the details. Here is one more from the 40s.
Ud Jaavun Re Main To Taaron Ki Duniyaa Men by Amirbai Karnataki, film Amrapali (1945), lyrics Kavi Pradeep, music Saraswati Devi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lw2X8wmDQjE

I am yet to find an appropriate song from the 30s, although in the film Chandidas (1934) we can find the mention of ‘Tare’ in the antara of the song tadapat bite din raina.
rat kate gin gin ke tare dhundhat naina sanjh sakhare
rat kate gin gin ke tare dhundhat naina sanjh sakhare
aavo sunaao man ke baati
aavo sunaao man ke baati
madhur madhur baina, madhur madhur baina
tadapat bite din raina

22 AK July 6, 2016 at 5:44 pm

Venkataramanji,
I would wait for Arunji’s response. The point still remains – Since it was not a well-know traditional tune, if GA Chishti had composed it in 1949, Hemant Kumar could have only got it from him directly or indirectly.

Tadpat beete din rain is one of Saigal’s best. This song fits in. Good that you remembered it. KS Bhatiaji came up with an unknown song from Bhakta Surdas. The famous one was sitting there: Chandni raat aur taare khilen hon by Saigal and Khursheed.

23 D P Rangan July 6, 2016 at 5:54 pm

I posted almost all the songs from my memory alone. When I analysed I found to my surprise and delight they covered the years 1950 to 59. Only one year was missing. As usual I approached AK and he gave me a good hint and that year also got covered. AK drew attention to this aspect in his masterly introduction and I thank him for it.

Vaisnhavji
Many thanks for your kind words.

Maheshji @3 and 15
Thank you for the appreciation and titbits. Give below you tube link for the song you suggested
https://youtu.be/jormbggeQTw
Have read lot of books of Carl Sagan. There are a few Dvds also and have seen them here in USA.
Subodhji
I am grateful for the kind words coming from an expert like you.
Dineshji
What masterly use of written message. It may be brief but conveys a world of meaning. Thanks for the same. Surprised you were a bit late in responding and at no. 6. Is it the case of hare and tortoise.

Bhatiaji
What an experience you have collected in your active life. A geologist turned into old film music gatherer. Thanks for your appreciation. You are the statistician for the group and expect as many songs as in Chand post from you.
KB @ 20
Here is the you tube link for the song
https://youtu.be/bQIUA1ifZ-s

Mohan Lalji @ 8
Thanks for the appreciation. Please suggest more songs on the theme. You tube link for the suggested song
https://youtu.be/aqR11_oYfrw

Ms. Shalini @ 9 & 10
Thanks for the response. Listened to all the songs you posted.
Siddharthji @ 18
Thank you for your appreciation of my post. CR is a great MD and am happy you included his song from Meenar.

Khayati Bhatt @ 5
Welcome to SoY on behalf of AK. Thanks for the appreciation. Seeing stars in a desert at night with no ground lights to suppress the sky would be an out of the world experience. Had such a luck in Thar desert in Rajasthan near Jaisalmer sometime in 1975.

24 D P Rangan July 6, 2016 at 6:53 pm

Venkataramanji

What an analysis of the subject. Thank you for the kind words of appreciation. You are an encyclopaedian and have lot of things to say on any subject. All my writings are primarily because of the encouragement from AK. I was initially very diffident, but have now picked up some courage to venture on unchartered waters. Words from an expert like you is as manna from heaven.

Arunkumarji @ 4
Getting a pat on the back from a living legend like you is too good to believe for me. Thanks for the same. I do not have knowledge about actors and their career graph. I presume people who post in you tube give facts. I just peruse and pick up snippets from them. Mention about Sandhya is a result of it. Can it be some other Sandhya. Now I will be more careful before relying on such data.

25 D P Rangan July 6, 2016 at 7:10 pm

Venkataramanji
Your wish has been fulfilled by AK. A sitare song from Chandi Das, 1934 by the immortal K L Saigal. You tube link

https://youtu.be/s4rzMF4WyiI

26 mumbaikar8 July 6, 2016 at 7:14 pm

D P Rangan
Thank you for the star shower.
It is difficult to say whether I enjoyed songs or the write up more. It is a real treat.
I enjoyed it more because I love gazing stars.
One more Pakistani ghazal by Iqbal banu.
Parshan raat sari hai sitaron tum to so jao
D P Rangan
Thank you for the star shower.
It is difficult to say whether I enjoyed songs or the write up more. It is a real treat.
I enjoyed it more because I love gazing stars.
One more Pakistani ghazal by Iqbal Bano.

Parshan raat sari hai sitaron tum to so jao

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43QgjhreVV8

27 D P Rangan July 6, 2016 at 11:20 pm

@26
Surprised to see you are caught in a split. Each part has its own attractions. People with a liking for star gazing may find the write up good enough for more exploration on the subject. Songs would be welcome by one and all. Thanks for your write up.

I am now giving a ten minute video on the most likely exo planets, i.e. planets revolving around other stars in our galaxy, to sustain life or colonisation by humans in the far future. Would urge all to have a look at it.
https://youtu.be/1P8nrDMNABM

28 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 6, 2016 at 11:23 pm

Ranganji,

As K.S.Bhatiaji has remarked, the timing of your post could not have been better! Am really floored by the expanse and depth of your knowledge as well as your enthusiasm and energy!

Here are a few more ‘taare/sitaare’ songs to add to your list:

1. ‘Do sitaaron ka zameen par hai milan aaj ki raat’ from Kohinoor:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ma8ht2nxEtQ

2. ‘Mausam hai aashiqaana’ from Pakeezah – it has the line ‘jugnu hai ya zameen par utren hue hain taaren’:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugpRuam-zz0

3. ‘Do diwaane shahar mein’ from Gharonda for the line ‘jab taare zameen par chalte hain’

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WofVW0xTIWM

4. ‘Chanda hai tu’ from Aradhana for the line ‘o mere aankhon ka taara hai tu’

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMcg7TMj1RM

5. ‘Yeh taara woh taara’ from Swades

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UzvpM3IwwY

6. ‘Phoolon ka taaron ka’ from Hara Rama Hare Krishna

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CMnsHi7B_A

29 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 6, 2016 at 11:25 pm

A Google search yielded this Anilda creation for Lata from Badi Bahu – ‘Sitaaron chaand se keh do’:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBkKOX3siiw

30 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 6, 2016 at 11:51 pm

The bhajan ‘Jab Janakinath sahaaya kare’ by Sant Tulsidas has the following stanza that states that when Lord Rama is on one’s side, one will always enjoy the benefic influence of the Sun, the Moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn while the malefic influence of Rahu and Ketu will be nullified:

Suraja mangala soma brigusuta
Budha aru guru vara daayak tero
Rahu ketu ki naahi gamyataa
Sanga shanichara hota uchero

Here is an edited version (it has 2 more stanzas) of the feelingly sung rendition of this bhajan by D.V.Paluskar:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaXqFfDriUo&list=RDgaXqFfDriUo#t=188

31 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 12:16 am

Muthuswami Dikshitar, one of the revered Trinity of Carnatic Music (the other two were Thyagarja and Syama Sastry), composed the Navagraha Kritis, a set of 9 compositions, each of which is a prayer to one of the 9 planets of Hindu mythology/astrology. Here is a write-up from wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navagraha_Kritis

My knowledge and appreciation of Carnatic music is superficial, so I will leave it to other readers to post links to recordings of these kritis and to write about them in detail.

One cannot speak of the navagraha kritis without mentioning the celebrated paintings of the navagrahas by the multifaceted musician and artist, the late S.Rajam (who was the elder brother of the late S.Balachander, the multifaceted vainika). Here is a blog-post that gives readers some idea of his genius:

http://creative.sulekha.com/legacy-of-chitrasutra-thirteen-shri-s-rajam-part-one_385189_blog

32 D P Rangan July 7, 2016 at 5:20 am

Ashwinji

Thanks for the kind words. Listened to the songs. Your reference to Navagraha Kriti @31 is appreciated. The nava grahas mentioned are Mercury, Venu, Maras, Jupiter, Saturn, Sun, Moon, Rahu and Kethu. Only Sun can be classified as star. Somehow it is part of our system and I tend to exclude it. Those kritis are exceptional.

33 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 7, 2016 at 11:02 am

AK ji@ 13 and Venkataraman ji,

Fact is when a song is recorded and the film does not get completed or released, the composer has no right on it and hardly anyone knows about that song since it is not exposed to the public. However, when a song is composed, and released in a film, the composer is almost owner of the song…may not be legally but atleast morally.
Thus when Chisti’s song was not released or completed, before he could use it, Hemant kumar’s version was already released and became a public song, out of courtesy and moral duty, Chisti might have asked for Hemant kumar’s permission.
I stand by what I have written even now.
-AD

34 ksbhatia July 7, 2016 at 11:24 am

AK ji;
Exploring and finding vintage song is a real treat for the listeners . Another of such song is from Gaon Ki Gori [ 1945 ] by Noor Jahan with music by Shyam Sunder .

Ye kaun hassa jisne sitaroan ko……..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U87y0l2ZRug

35 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 12:05 pm

The number of khayal bandishes written from the point of view of the virahotkanthita naayika, the one who is distressed by the separation from her lover, is legion. These naayikaas are usually depicted as biding the night counting the stars in the firmament. Some examples of such bandishes:

1. Eri aali piya bina (Yaman/Yaman Kalyan):

Bhimsen Joshi’s rendition of the cheez:

http://youtu.be/cf-s2bZNl7w

Lata’s rendition under Roshan’s baton, from the film Raagrang:

http://youtu.be/89AjqBI8pcU

2. Taarwa ginat ginat in Raga Bibhas (the Marwa Thaat variant) by Ashwini Bhide-Deshpande – this drut bandish composed by Sadarang starts at 25:35.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UwTRQ3iYkiQ#

36 ksbhatia July 7, 2016 at 12:09 pm

DP Rangan ji;
#23 , Quite a number of sitaare song exists in Chand series . Duplicating here will not be worth the excercise. I will be posting some taare/ sitaare song which may still carry the chand as prefix or suffix by fault.

Here are a few as starter ,

1. Gin gin taare main har gayi….Lata……Jadoo[1951]….Naushad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1BnRgfIhKY

2.Chand se poochho sitaroan se …..Lata, Hemant…Daku Ki Ladki…Hemant Kumar…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n50mNpmy7y8

3.Jhil mil taare kaaren…..Mukesh, Suraiya….Mashuka[1954]…Roshan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zthBD6hwQqw

4.Yeh chand sitaare kyau jaane….Suraiya…Khoobsurat[1952]…MM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQVELshZXwY

5. yeh sitaare yeh chand….Lata…Danka[1954]…Aziz…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWDMDXbzWEQ

6.Dekho chanda se khelen sitaare….Madhubala Zaveri….Dost[1954]…Hansraj behl
[This song seems to be based upon old punjabi song of Lata ji…..naale lambi te naale kaali hondi aye chaana raat jhudaiyan wali.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrA74uylO8Q

7. So ja re so ja….Lata…..Jeewan Jyoti[1953]….SDB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIY_lO8YXIE

8.Taaron bhari raat hai…Rafi, Suraiya….Kajal [1948]….Gulam Mohd.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1ZyTRe7WAA

9.Taaroan ka yeh khazana….Rafi, Shamshad….Nisbat[1949]…Gobind ram

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVflkcWPkb8

10.Yeh Taaroan bhari….Rafi, Geeta Dutt….Hamaari Shaan….MD[?]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=duLAHY8hAdc

…….to be contd……

37 ksbhatia July 7, 2016 at 12:26 pm

…..in continuation of songs @36.

11.Raat ko ji chamke taare….Mukesh, Shamshad….Aag[1948]..Ram Ganguly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kV4UrtMbJ2M

12.Doob jaye jo kismat ka taara….Lata…Parchaiyan[1952]….CR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nm50ZQ7eDA

13.Yeh chand to mrudang hai taare hain …….Shyama, Rafi…..Shri Krishna Arjun Yudh….Nandu, Pyaare

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CkfV4FESHaA

14.Na yeh chand hoga na taare ….Hemant….Shart[1954]…Hemant

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfpMM6O1qsc

15.Gardish mein ho taare……Mukesh….Reshmi Roomal [1960] ..Babul

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DsWss3-zq8

……to be contd….

38 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 2:08 pm

Scroll down to the last piece in this link (http://music-fundaaz.blogspot.in/2009/01/early-morning-ambience-raag-bhtiyar.html) for a short but comprehensive treatment of Raga Bhatiyaar by Manik Varma from an LP that was released way back in the 60’s. The violin accompaniment is by V.G.Jog. The sthaayi of the bada khayal is ‘Ginat rahi main to taare’.

39 Shalan Lal July 7, 2016 at 2:13 pm

Shalan Lal
DP Rangan @ 11 and all other SoY lovers
Call it serendipity, or “Ittafaq”, or Yog +Ayog= Yogayog, Sanjog, per chance etc. DP your article appeared on 4th July American Independence Day on which a spacecraft probe Juno journeying for five years got fixed in the orbit of the Jupiter. So I should say in the SoY sky your star is rising high and shining like moon and star or morning and evening star or both like Venus and Jupiter.
But don’t get agitated when I say the astronomical Intro is astronomically long and not much related to the Indian filmy songs. But then both AK and you too agreed to it. Then why put it there? This abnormally wide ball should not have been thrown in the first place.
Many star songs are sad songs as there are so many superstitions. “Tara Toota” for example.
It would have been interesting if the “astrological” superstitious paragraph would have been added as most of the filmy and the Indian political world and general public are dominated by the stars reading in the most of the mornings to start their “Muhurt” and other ventures private, public and businesses etc..
The noted incident was when pretty Aishvarya was going to be married to Bachhan Bachha they found in her astrological chart the Mangal was aggressively placed. She had to undergo some ardent rituals to pacify the angry Mars and keep the horse and the bridegroom at the bay for a while.
The actress Suraiya (Persian word) is named after the third Nakshatra Krutika. I think she sang some star songs, five stars songs I presume.
While “Nargis” is cursing about her misfortune believing that she is ugly, for the thousands of years in the Garden of Allah as there are hardly any connoisseurs around.
The seven Rishis in English are called Seven Sisters or in Greek are Pleiades cluster
The selection of songs is good and the rest will be ksbhatia’s “add on” field. The other co-star of the film “Samadhi” is Kuldip Kaur a veteran actor in the villain roles in a number of films. There is a funny song called “Angreji Chhora Chala Gaya” in the film Samadhi I think but I could be wrong. I have been wrong before.
Here is a western superstitious song from the play called “Hair” ran riot in the sixties in the West End and Broadway:
Aquarius

When the moon is in the Seventh House
And Jupiter aligns with Mars
Then, peace will guide the planets
And love will steer the stars

This is the dawning of the Age of Aquarius
Age of Aquarius
Aquarius! Aquarius!
Harmony and understanding
Sympathy and trust abounding
No more falsehoods or derisions
Golden living dreams of visions
Mystic crystal revelation
And the mind’s true liberation
Aquarius! Aquarius!

Shalan Lal

40 Siddharth July 7, 2016 at 2:18 pm

Few more songs –

1.Nacho Sitaro Nacho – Zeenat (1945)
Singer: Noorjehan
MD: Hafeez Khan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXqoveaYEVg

2.Surmai Raat hai sitaren hain- JORU KA BHAI(1955)
Singer: Lata
MD- JAIDEV
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBP3vu0hcOY

3.Meri Aankhon Ke Tare – Aap Ki Sewa Mein 1947
Singer: Mohammed Rafi
MD: Datta Davjekar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_OjZazh3So

4. JHILMIL TAARE KARE ISHARE- FILM- MASHOOQA(1953)
Singer: MUKESH- SURAIYA
MD: Roshan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6jborK1Mdc

5.Awara Hoon – Awaara
Singer: Mukesh
MD: Shankar Jaikishan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VY1pWTek2sY

41 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 2:31 pm

Two renditions of the naatyapad ‘Naachat naa gaganaata naathaa’ from the musical Punya Prabhav by two illustrious members of the same family – Deenanath Mangeshkar and Jitendra Abhisheki:

http://geet.fm/album/23057/punya-prabhav-drama-pandit-jitendra-abhisheki.html?format=48

The 2nd line of the song is ‘Taaraanchi barasaat naathaa’

42 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 2:46 pm

1. We seem to have forgotten that the #2 song from the Best Songs of 1949 has the line ‘sitaare apni roshni lutaa lutaa ke so gaye’.

‘Suhaani raat dhal chuki’ from Dulaari:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LjF6yjrgYU

2. Another Rafi gem is ‘Maine chaand aur sitaaron ki tamanna ki thi’ from Chandrakanta:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_Dqn-SLK2w

43 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 4:08 pm

The Gaud Malhar natyapad ‘Nabha meghaani aakramile’ from the musical Saubhadra describes how no stars can be seen (‘taarangana sarvahi zhaankuni gele’) as the thunderclouds envelop the sky. Here is Prabhakar Karekar’s rendition of this song:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0MKfZcWjLo

44 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 7, 2016 at 4:20 pm

Shalan Lal ji,

Angrezi chhora chala gaya is from film Majboor-48.Mukesh/Lata, MD-Ghulam Hyder.

-AD

45 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 4:27 pm

In his poem, ‘Jana palabhara mhanatila haaya haaya’ B.R.Tambe, the great Marathi poet, makes a poignant point: when a person dies, the world laments her only for a short while, after which things go back to BAU (Business As Usual) mode, to use terminology common in the IT services industry. One of the examples he cites – how the stars will continue to move in their orbits (‘taare apulaa krama aacharatila’). The poem was set to Miyan Malhar by Vasant Prabhu and recorded by Lata in the 50’s:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hmiPh2fWYI

46 Dinesh K Jain July 7, 2016 at 4:46 pm

Angrezi chhora is actually the very first song that Lata sang for the Bollywood!

47 Giri July 7, 2016 at 7:40 pm

Rangan ji,
I don’t know what your profession is, but you could be a teacher of astrology! The amount of data you have collected and all the knowledge you have on astrology is simply astounding. Congratulations on a scholarly post.
I am not familier with many songs as my contact with HFM is only after the mid fifties. The main advantage I derive in visiting SOY is in getting to know the real vintage music, thanks to AK and other regulars and experts like Bhatiaji, Arun Kumar Deshmukhji etc.

48 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 7, 2016 at 8:24 pm

‘Neel gagan par baadal dole, dole har ek tara’

‘Meri laadli’ from Andaaz:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98kyvAr8J0A

49 Mahesh July 7, 2016 at 8:31 pm

https://youtu.be/3qwS4l5TEq0

Mukesh in Sheesham under Roshan.

50 D P Rangan July 7, 2016 at 10:48 pm

Bhatiaji @36

Song No. 7. I see a Geeta Dutt version of the song. Please check.

https://youtu.be/7Y4zvw28lj4

51 AK July 7, 2016 at 10:57 pm

Dinesh,
Your statement at #46 needs some correction. Lata Mangeshkar’s debut as a ‘playback’ singer was in Aap Ki Sewa Mein (1947) with the thumri Paon lagun kar jori re. But her first song in Bollywood was still earlier in Badi Ma (1945) – Mata tere charnon mein – as actor-singer (yes, she had a bit role in that film, and some more films until she completely settled for ‘playback’ singing in 1947). For the sake of record, her singing career started still earlier with Marathi films, in 1942. All these are in public domain and most of her early songs are available on YT. Sudhir Kapur has done a nice summary of her various firsts here: http://atulsongaday.me/2012/09/29/mata-tere-charnon-mein-guzar-jaaye-umariya/.

However, Angrezi chhora is also a first of some kind – it is her first duet with Mukesh.

52 Mahesh July 7, 2016 at 11:22 pm

AK ji,

Anokha Pyar under Anil Biswas, with two duets of the duo was also released in 1948. But I suppose you are right as these duets were first recorded with Menna Kapoor and introduced in the film version with Lata later on.

53 Dinesh K Jain July 8, 2016 at 10:10 am

Thanks, AK, for the most interesting and authentic information.

54 ksbhatia July 8, 2016 at 1:10 pm

DP Ranganji@50 ;
The Geeta Dutt version of ….so ja re….is amazing , beautifully rendered .

In continuation of songs # 37; here are few more…..

16.Taro ki toliyon……Shamshad, Durrani….Ghar ki Izzat[1948]…Gobind Ram

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vC4t7g5VSuA

17.Tar ra ra rum….Lata…..Arab ki hoor[1955]…..Gulam. Mohd

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmY1fdSwT1E

18.Khamosh hain sitaare….Talat…..Haar Jeet[1954]…S D Batish

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qx4UFu3jAAs

19.Dur gagan pe chamke sitare…..Geeta Dutt, Dilip Dholakiya[ Asstt to S N T]…Ram Hanuman Yudh….S N Tripathi

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NdJJq_QrEc

20. Chand sitare karte …..Lata, Talat….Adl E Jahangir.[1955] [HB]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBsCZkFAs6U

….to be contd….

55 ksbhatia July 8, 2016 at 1:39 pm

GIRI ji;
Thanks for your appreciation and encouragement . The efforts to post as many songs for the passionate listeners of the golden period songs is a fun for me. Adding Vintage songs is ice on the cake .

Adding more of Sitaare in the universe…..

21.Yaad rakhna chand taaro….Lata….Anokha Pyar[1948]….Anil Biswas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGp1m8I2ALA

22.Duniya ko pyare phool sitare…Shamshad…Patanga[1949]….CR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3Eo9Z5jZcw

23. Yeh shokh sitare….Rafi, Lata….Ek thi Ladki.[1949]….Vinod

[ Pick of the day ]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88WdmE7PcLg

24. Sitare raah takte hain….Lata…Black Cat [1958]……N. Dutta

[Another pick of the day]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ejzd2s-LgFk

25.Lakhoan taare aasman pe …Mukesh, Lata…Hariyali aur raasta..SJ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9skcQBCMuHY

….to be contd……

56 N Venkataraman July 8, 2016 at 3:07 pm

Arun Ji, AK ji
First of all let me thank Arun Ji for the response (#33). I understand that based on the information available , Arun Ji stands by what he had written. Fair enough, no arguments about it. Yet I would like to carry forward this discussion, not just to contradict or challenge Arun Ji’s view point, but with the expectation that some new information may crop-up through further queries and interaction.

The first question that comes-up is, when the production of the unreleased Indian film, Sassi, launched. No definite information could be obtained. Going back to Arun Ji’s article in the site ‘Atul Song A Day’, posted on 28th October 2014, I quote

“The Hindi Film Geet kosh lists some unreleased films’ names in every volume. In 1930s such unreleased films listed were- 7, in the 40s they were-45, in the 50s they were-35, in the 60s the number was-31 films and the 70s had – 69 unreleased films. That is a total of only 187 films in 50 years. But this figure is just the tip of the Iceberg. There are countless number of films which ended halfway or were not released at all, for whatever reasons. The HFGK does not list such films. …….One such unreleased film was “SASSI” in the late 40s.………………… Not much information is available on why this film was not released, but songs were recorded for this movie. Most songs were not available, but one song was discovered, thanks to the efforts of Shri Girdharilal ji, Vishwakarma ji and Dr. Surjit Singh ji (who made it available on his site).”

While posting the song he mentions the year as 1940, which I am sure was due to oversight, since Arun ji’s article was based on the available information, which in this case I believe was Hindi Film Geet Kosh (HFGK), where the year is not mentioned. On verification I came to know that the details of the film and seven songs are listed in the Appendix I of its second Volume. One site mentions the year as 1948. Ak Ji in his comment (#22), asks

“Since it was not a well-known traditional tune, if GA Chishti had composed it in 1949, Hemant Kumar could have only got it from him directly or indirectly.”

Probably what he meant to say was ’If G A Chisti had composed it before 1949…..’. Chisti left for Pakistan in 1949.

HFGK gives the following information on this film, besides mentioning the first lines of the seven songs that were supposedly composed for this unreleased film.
Produced by Eveready Pictures, directed by Daood Chand, lyrics Aziz Merathi, music G A Chisti and the name of the artists.

Probing further I could gather that Jagdish Chand Anand was the founder of Eveready Pictures/Productions. As per the information found in the following link
http://thereel.scroll.in/807775/most-pakistani-hindu-filmmakers-fled-after-1947-but-not-jc-anand

“He was born in 1922 in Bhera, a small town in Punjab’s Sargodha district. His father was an importer of goods from Japan, but trade floundered with the onset of WWII. Rather than carry on with his father’s work, Anand turned his attention to the film industry, working first with a distribution company in Lahore. He soon graduated to releasing films as a so-called second party – he would buy the film rights from the main distributor and run prints in smaller towns or at single-screen cinemas. After forming his own company, Eveready Pictures, in 1946, Anand broke through as an important distributor after 1947 by distributing Indian films, notably the Bombay Talkies smash hit Mahal (1949) and Raj Kapoor’s films, including Barsaat (1949) and Awara (1951).

When Pakistan was formed in 1947, most of its Hindu population migrated to India, but not Jagdish Chand Anand. The producer and distributor stayed back in Karachi after the Partition, and continued to run a hugely successful business that included the distribution of major Indian releases in Pakistan. As indigenous productions began to slowly emerge in Pakistan beginning with Dawood Chand’s Teri Yaad (1948), Anand foresaw challenges in the release of Indian films. With funds largely acquired from distributing Indian films, Anand decided to do his bit for the Pakistani film industry, launching his first local film as a producer. Sassi (1954) was based on the well-known tragic love story of Sassi and Punhun.”

If the unreleased Indian film Sassi was lauched by Eveready pictures, as mentioned in HFGK, then the production must have commenced in 1946 or 1947, before it was shelved. But from the above information it appears Eveready pictures was a primarily a distribution company during its initial years and ventured into production only in 1954. Most probably Sassi (1954) was J C Anand’s first production venture, and a big budget film by Pakistan standards. I assume that it would have taken at least a couple of years for J C Anand to garner enough funds to launch his first production venture. Further the article does not mention anything about J C Anand’s/Eveready Pictures’ production ventures during pre-independence period.

Cineplot (http://cineplot2.com/j-c-anand/) also gives similar information on J C Anand and Eveready Pictures.
May be Arun Ji and AK Ji can seek further clarifications from Harminder Ji, Surjit Ji.

57 AK July 8, 2016 at 4:48 pm

Venkataramanji,
This is an interesting analysis. Since you have revived the topic, my point was about who created the tune first, not which came in public domain first. In scientific research, it is possible that two persons researching the same topic independently arrive at similar conclusion. If the person discovering the result first is slack in publishing his paper, the later person gets the credit. The first person would have no means of proving that he did it first. In a song tune, it is impossible that two composers working independently arrive at the same tune. That would mean Hemant Kumar got it unethically and GA Chshti quietly lumped it.

58 Shalan Lal July 8, 2016 at 5:36 pm

DP Rangan

Is Dallas burning/ is America on Fire?

Forget it. Just thought I would bring you down to the earth as you are living in the world of “Chand Sitare”

Here is the song many have forgotten to mention

From the good old Anadaz:
टूटे ना दिल टूटे ना टूटे ना
दिल को तेरे बहला सकता हूँ
चाँद-सितारे ला सकता हूँ
रो सकता हूँ गा सकता हूँ
मुझसे अगर तू रूठे ना दिल टूटे ना
टूटे ना दिल …

Shalan

59 Mahesh July 8, 2016 at 5:59 pm

chaand ko dhoondhhe paagal sooraj,
shaam ko dhoondhe saweraa…….Rafi saab in Baiju Bawra (1952)

sooraj ko dharti tarse
dharti ko chandrmaa…………..Mukesh in Anokhi Raat (1968)

These are not the opening lines but readers could well associate the songs.

60 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 8, 2016 at 6:25 pm

AK ji and Venkataraman ji,
I think this is not the proper place to discuss about this song, since this is a forum for some other topic.
Such discussions should have taken place in ” open house “.
I too have a lot to write so I am shifting this thread to Open House.
Please read my reply there.
-AD

61 D P Rangan July 8, 2016 at 9:58 pm

Here is a chronological list of early Lata songs

Kiti hasaal 1942
Nachu ya gade khelu
Pehli mangalagaur 1942
Natli chairachinavala with S Pradhan
Gajabhau 1943
Mata ek sapoot ki duniya
Dhaav sakhya giridhari
Badi maa 1945
Janani janambhoomi swargadarpi
Mata tere charnon men with ?
Tum maa ho badi maa with Meenakshi
Jevan yatra 1946
Chidiya bole choon choon maina bole hoon
Sona chandni 1946
Pyare bapu ki
Subhadra 1946
Piya aayega gori shudh na bisaar
Sanwariya o basuriya o bajaai gayo re
Main khili khili phulvari with Shanta Apte
Shaadi se pehle 1947
Chalo ho gayi taiyaar zara tehro with Mohd Rafi
Shenai 1947
Jawani ki rel chali with Geeta Dutt & C Ramchandra
Aap ki sewa men 1947
Ab kaun sunega mere man ki baat
Ek naye rang men duje umang men
Paa lagu kar joda jodi hori shyam mose na
Shaheed 1947
Pinjre men bulbul bole with Madan mohan ( not used )
Andho ka sahara 1948
Main to naacho chhama chham naach re
Asha 1948
Door jaye re raah meri aaj teri raah se
Sajna re tori kaun dagariya
Chet chet kar chal madhur nar
Ek moorat manohar meri ankhiyan ko tarse
Kit jaye base he murari tohe dhoondhat radha
Anokha pyar 1948
Ek dil ka lagana baqi tha
Yaad rakhna chand
Jevan sapna toot gaya
Bhola bhala ri mera balma na jane
Ghadi ghadi poocho na
Mere phoolon men chhipi hai
Mere liye wo gham e intezaar
Yaad rakhna chand taron with Mukesh
Ab yaad kar bhool ja aye dil with Mukesh
Aye dil meri wafa men koi asar with Meena Kapoor
Aye dil meri wafa men koi asar with Ira Nagrath

Bihari 1948
Sab se ki durfishani phoolon ka shamiyana
Chand sitare 1948
Jab dil men tere dard
Meri naav chale dheere dheere
Aye duniya ki malik mujhe tujhse mila hai
Chunaria 1948
Dil e nashaad ko jeene ki hasrat
Ankh meri lad gayi re with Inder Goyal
Didi 1948
Tere nainon men nindiya nindiya men sapne
Dukhiyari 1948
Ab kisko sunaoon main katha krishna
Gajre 1948
Baras baras badli
Ghar yahan basane aaye the
Preetam tera mera pyar
Kab tak kategi zindagi kinare kinare
Chali dulhan baratiyon ke peeche with Ira Nagrath
Heer Ranjha 1948
Kahe ko byahi bides
Kaise katoo yeh kali raaten aa balam
Khamosh fasana hai with G M Duranni
Khidki 1948
Khushiyan manaye with Shamshad B & Mohantara
Tere bina soona with Geeta Dutt & C Ramchandra
Majboor 1948
Dil mera toda ho mujhe kahin ka na choda
Piya milne ko aa
Ab koi jee ke kya kare
Angrezi chhora chala gaya with Mukesh
Har shei pe jawani hai with Geeta Dutt
Gori sakhiyon se with Geeta Dutt
Mandir 1948
Lo woh aayi nindiya chhup chup dheere
Mere lal 1948
Hamara ghar ban jaye mehlon se pyara sundar
Meri kahani 1948
Dilwalon dilon ka mel dilon ka khel
Nehin nehin boondaniyan jiya lehraye
Nadiya ke paar 1948
Ho gori ho chori kahan chali ho with C Ramchandra
Padmini 1948
Bedard tere dard ko seene se laga ke
Ziddi 1948
Jadu kar gai kisi ke naina
Ab kaun sahara hai jab tera sahara
Rooth gaye more shyam sakhi re
Tujhe o bewafa hum zindagi ka aasra
Chanda re ja re ja piya se sandesa mora
Ye kaun aaya re karke with Kishore Kumar

62 D P Rangan July 8, 2016 at 10:15 pm

Ms. Shalan Lal @ 39 and 58

You did not disappoint me. As expected there was a detailed observation from you. I just wrote the post as I thought best. I did not combine the astrological aspect at all. My write up was quite long and adding more would have upset the apple cart. Veterans like you can add all sorts of comments as a complement. I fully appreciate your views.

Giriji @47
Welcome you to SoY on behalf of AK. I wrote on astronomical aspect and not astrology. My father was a great astrologer but did not pass on the skill to us. He maintained that it wast not good ethics to apply his knowledge to his family. He compiled mere horoscope for all of us and left it at that.

63 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 8, 2016 at 10:55 pm

‘Twinkle, twinkle, little star’ with a twist by the versatile Revathy Sankaran:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DssSpNqbc64

64 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 8, 2016 at 10:59 pm

The Star Spangled Banner, the national anthem of the US of A:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QTOZGP-rr0

65 AK July 9, 2016 at 7:09 am

Ashwin,
Heard Revathi Sankaran for the first time. Great talent. Thanks a lot for introducing her.

66 Giri July 9, 2016 at 12:11 pm

Rangan ji@62
I am extremely sorry. That was bad typing. I was having in mind ‘astronomy’ but typed ‘astrology’
Please accept my apologies.

67 ksbhatia July 9, 2016 at 2:36 pm

DP Rangan ji;
The song #24 @ 55 is already covered in your main article . I offer my apology for repeating it.

68 Shalan Lal July 9, 2016 at 2:47 pm

DP Rangan @ 57 & 58

I am extremely grateful that once for all sombody like you have done the Chronological list of Early Lata. Three cheers for you.

It seems that your father was very wise man not to pass Astrollogical toss up and bunkum boloney.

Your knowledge of astronomy is staggering eand enjoyable to read but I beleive it was a very wrong Intro to your well researched star songs subject. I like the title very much and as expected the shower was brought by ksbhatiy, Bhandarkar and many others.

It is sleeping in the “Chandani Raat – Moonlit night.

Great post for songs galore collectors.

Shalan

69 Shalan Lal July 9, 2016 at 3:00 pm

Ashwin Bhandarkar @45 and other comments as well

Mr Bhandarkar your mentions of so many songs and classical songs from the plays acted by the legndary father Dinanath Mangeshkar and other rare songs you annotate with the classical ragas and rhythms are extremly helpful and perhaps you write longer articles on the certain songs that based on or exploited the ragas aptly or otherwise.

I always feel that song Lata and Rafi sing in Suwaran Sundari has much influence of mangeshkar family than the melodic invention of the music director of that film. Perhaps you may know more or have some ideas about it.

With great respect I thank you very much.

Shalan

70 ksbhatia July 9, 2016 at 3:40 pm

Siddharth ji;
Your posting of song…Awara hoon…have prompted me to post some of the best of Taare/ Sitaare songs of the great composers Shankar Jaikishan . As Anil ji and all other knows I am a great admirer of the duos who brought out modernisation of the changing time thru their beautiful melodies and to top it all thru their orchestration as well. Many passionate followers have compiled the various preludes of the songs on a single track and have posted on Y T. Some have compiled the Dholak songs and a few have loaded the passions of SJ with violin . Such are their fan followers ; and many celebrated MDs and singers have also rated them as number one .

Continuing my passion as well i am posting some of S J ‘s taare/ sitaare songs here.

26.Woh chand khila woh taare……Lata, Mukesh…..Anari

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvtU5FYxK-c

27.Hum hain to chand aur taare…..Mukesh, chorus…Main naashe mein hun

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHYBImf6KFA

28.Haaye gajab kahin taara toota……Asha…..Teesri Kasam

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKhlaZmaNSU

29.Kisi ne apna [ …Koi sitaare loota raha tha kisi ne daman bichha diya….] beautiful lyrics……Lata….Patita

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MA72LAYKZRg

30.Taaroan se pyaare…..Mukesh…..Diwaana

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3bUyxWQhSI

31.Preet yeh kaisi bol [ …..dhoondu taaron mein ghar apna…]….Lata….Daag

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6GrBRIkrbk

32.Koi nahin hai mera….[…har taara be sahara…]…Talat…Daag

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDD1dODXfn4

33.Aa Aa aa bhi ja…[…. Sitaron ne muh pher kar kaha ulvida humsafar..]….Lata…..Teesri Kasam

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5MxynKecJIQ

34. Badan pe sitare lapate huai….Rafi….Prince
[ one of the best songs of the mid 60s ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C48Wmgj-Hc4

Now I am posting one of my fav. song …..Ramayya vastawaiyya… .The beauty of this song is how the music and situation helps in transforming the mood and continuity of the story . The prelude to the main song, the orchestration , chrorography , camera movements, editing and photography, all are excellent . Enjoy the song.

35.Ramayya vastawaiyya…[ Rusta wohi aur musafir wohi ek taara na jaane kahan chhup gaya ..]…Mukesh, Lata, Rafi, chorus…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rW72kDrJvwA

…..to be contd….

71 SSW July 9, 2016 at 4:27 pm

@69 , the ragamalika in Suvarna Sundari had nothing to do with the Mangeshkar family. The original song “Hayi Hayiga” for the original Suvarna Sundari in Telugu was composed by Adi Narayan Rao too. The hindi remake came a year later I think. The only contribution was that Lata sang the part that was originally rendered by Jikki.
Here is the original
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5ajXn9j1bM
The ragas used are Hamsanandi, Kaanada, Jivanpuri and Yamana Kalyani

72 ksbhatia July 10, 2016 at 1:14 pm

D P Rangan ji;
In continuation to songs @70, here are a few more….

36.Aao badal chaain se royen[…chand ke saath taare kitne..]….Talat …Awara Ladki…..Dhani ram

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8ib9luaxak

37.Ab raat gayi hai beet […chup gaye sitare..]….Surendra Nath…Kamal[1949]….SDB

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVxqKD7eVEQ

38.Soye huye hain chand sitare…..Talat…Private Ghazal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-h3QaaAng8

39.Naachun re gaon re…[ …chand taaroan ke sung..]…Asha…Aab E Hayyat……Sardar Malik

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vp81IijY7g

40.Badli mein chand…[..Kaun sa taara…]…Lata, Rafi…Kabhi dhup kabhi chhaon..]….Chitragupt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPaGdXFDgdY

….to be contd…

73 ksbhatia July 10, 2016 at 3:50 pm

….in continuation here are few vintage classic songs reserved for the classic listeners ….

41.Chand hassa akash pe taaroan mein ishaare hone lage…..Ameer Bai Karnatki…..Naiki Badi [ 1949]…..Roshan Lal [ probably his first]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLwA4ZBVdvg

42.Akhiyan ke tum taare…Vasanti…Amar jyoti[1936]….Master Krishnarao

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6MwuMf7BA4

43.Yeh chand taare ….Singer[?]….Tigress[1948]…Chitragupt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksQamgrkFqc

44.Chand hain taare bi hain….Rafi, Suman….Rooplekh..Nashad

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfDH9sMmQvE

45. Here is a masterly private song of the great Rafi Sahib . Should find a respected place in every passionate listeners drawing room or their music studio . I am still listening again and again since morning .
I will surely like to know the listeners view .

….Keh ke bhi na aaye mulakat ko…chand taare hase khub kal raat ko…..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcsgFYGvKhw

…..to be contd….

74 Shalan Lal July 10, 2016 at 5:36 pm

SSW @ 71
Thanks for your comment. In the post Panchhi I have well described the contribution of Aadi Narayan with the reference of the said song.

However my point was and is that the melody or the Ragas that went along with the song are from the Northern Indian music. The father of Lata was a very famous actor on the Marathi musicals. Some of the plays he tranaslated in Hindustani and travelled all around India. There was a very close relation between the South Indian film making and Marathi film making. Shantram himself was a stage actor on the Marathi Musical stage before he joined a silent film making company created by veteran painter and film maker Baburao Painter. Furtehr on in late fifties or early sixties my brother took me to a Park where Dinanths’s contemporary musical actor called Gandahrv was publically honoured and the famous actor Shivaji Ganeshan was present and remebered how he enjoied the Marathi Musicals and particularly of both Dinanath and Gandahrv. Iwas very little then and did not understand fully what was going on. But Mangeshkar sisters were there and they both sang classical songs of their father.

As Mr Bhandarkar is so scholar in the classical music both Independent and also film music I wanted to explore the relationship of that particular song. So I raised that matter with Mr Bhandarkar.

Shalan Lal

75 SSW July 10, 2016 at 8:35 pm

Ms.Lal, I have very little to say on the tenuous links you have provided with Shivaji Ganesan and and Gandharv and any relation that has with a Telugu film. I am also somewhat baffled how you have come to the conclusion that the song is based entirely on North Indian ragas, when there are equivalent Carnatic ragas, that I have named, on which any Indian trained in Carnatic music would be familiar.
However since your questions were directed to Mr. Bhandarkar he can answer you.

76 SSW July 10, 2016 at 8:57 pm

I will say though that it is generally accepted that Jaunpuri (originally Yavan Puri ??) came into Carnatic music from Hindustani but since Purandaradasa is supposed to have composed a piece sung in Jaunpuri I suppose it’s adaptation into Carnatic safely puts it quite a bit earlier than the 19th and 20th centuries so a bit before Dinanath Mangeshkar.

77 Giri July 11, 2016 at 4:55 pm

I agree with SSW. Adinarayana Rao is a famous MD from Andhra. He was the husband of Anjali Devi and has given music to many films produced by her in which she acted also. I have listened to the tunes of Swarna Sundari in Tamil and Telugu. His other famous hit was ‘Adutha veettu Penn’ (remade in Hindi as Padosan), also produced by Anjali Devi.
By the way I have never read about Sivaji Ganesan mentioning anything about Marathi music, although Lataji was a family friend of his.

78 Ashwin Bhandarkar July 11, 2016 at 10:00 pm

Shalan Lal,

Thanks for your kind words about my contributions to this blog. Yes, I am cognizant of the fact that I have more knowledge of ragas, and the like, compared to the average Hindi film song lover, but I am not a scholar by any stretch of imagination, so request you not to refer to me as one – it makes me cringe with embarrassment.

On the subject of the Mangeshkar contribution to ‘Kuhu kuhu bole koyaliya’, I agree with SSW that it is limited to Lata lending her voice to the song. I also agree with the views he has stated in #75.

79 Shalan Lal July 12, 2016 at 3:47 pm

Ashwin Bhandarkar @ 78
Thanks for your view. As you have gone deeper into the contribution of the plays that Dinanath M quoted by you I had a feeling that the spread of the Marathi musical plays from the 19th century onwards had the universal appeal in India and was the basis of the popular music in India before the talkies arrived. I shall not dispute over the contribution of Tagore and folk songs and street singers and religious singers etc.

My reference to the event of the celebration of Gandharv the god of Marathi Musicals was in view that the Marathi Musicals could have been the precursors of the film music and most of those songs were either based on the classical ragas or light folk tunes. Plus the presence of the famous actor Shivaji Ganeshan on the stage showed that the Marathi Musicals broke the linguistic wall and went to the other regions as well. We are not Marathi but from our Grand father, grandmother uncles etc always went and saw Marathi musicals. My grand father had good memeories of Dinaanth and Gandharva

I remeber reading a researched article on the Marathi Musical that has the reference that Dinnanth translated Marathi plays in the Hindustani and took them as far as Delhi and as wide as Calcutta.

So my view was based on those facts.

As previously mentioned I had freely praised the contribution of the Aadi Narayan to the music.

However I wanted to say that when particular singer is asked to sing some songs especially Lata who had already showed her command on all styles of singing songs her contribution to the creative process would not be just imitative to sing as the directors would tell ehr to sing. Both sisters have showed it was not just their voice on hire but their re-creative power was there in most of the songs they sang.

I would like believe that this is the difference between them and the other singers. Take Lata out of the “Kuhu Kuhu” song and I think the song would sound insipid and it is not just of her voice but her re-creative power.

Shalan Lal

80 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 12, 2016 at 5:38 pm

Shalan Lal ji,

The name you are referring to often, should be BAL GANDHARVA and not just Gandharva. This was the title given to Narayanrao Rajhans, repotedly by Lokmanya Tilak.
Later on there were other conferred titles to singers like Sawai Gandharva, kumar Gandharva etc. Therefore it is necessary to mention the correct name BAL GANDHARVA.
Thanks.
-AD

81 Shalan Lal July 13, 2016 at 2:04 pm

Arunkumar Deshmukh @ 80
Thank you Mr Deshmukh for correcting my addressing to Bal Gandharv. In our family he was called Gandharv and that’s how I got used to the name.

I was not aware about other Gandharvas. But it seems at one time or the other Maharashtra was like the Indrasabha with so many various Gandharvas. I wonder are there any new Gandharvas or a Gandharva now in making? This is just joking and not to hurt the Marathi feelings.

I shall look for other Gandharvas at my leisure.
Thanks again

Shalan Lal

82 Shalan Lal July 13, 2016 at 2:09 pm

AK @ 51 and DP Rangan @ 61 The song of Lata in Aap Ki Sewa Mein (1947) is titled as Paa Laalgu Re Muzase Naa Karo Jora Jori…” on my cassette of Rare Lata Songs.
This copy of the collection was given to me by an East African Gujarati whose family moved to live in England.
In the HFGK Vol II, It says “Paa Laag, Kar Jori Re, Shaam Mose Naa Khelo Holi”
AK has said, “Paon lagun kar jori re. “ and
DP have “Paa lagu kar joda jodi hori shyam mose na”.
I think with each of these headings the meaning of the line changes.

As this song was lost and the film is not available it may be confusing to find the real title. The song is now available on the cassette. But my cassete is dropped behind the shelf and I cannot recover it.

This and following areas could be the province of Mr Deshmukh.

The lyricist of the “Aap Ki Sewa Mein” is Mahipal. Who is this Mahipal? Could this Mahipal be the same who acted in B Grade films of Wadia Bros? And occasionally in films like Parasmani, Navrang, Hatimtai Ki Beti, Zabak, Aladdin & the Wonderful Lamp etc.?
Shalan Lal

83 D P Rangan July 14, 2016 at 3:30 am

@82

Checked up. The film music was composed by Mahipal and lyrics Datta Davjekar. Here is the you tube link of the song. AK version appears to be correct.

https://youtu.be/lmFjV7HhAvI

84 D P Rangan July 14, 2016 at 3:36 am

Another astonishing piece of news.

Lyrist composed a few songs and Mahipal turned lyrist for a few songs. Thus both the individuals did dual job of Music Director and writing of the songs. For example there is a song of Mohammad Rafi –
Meri ankhon ke tare – music Davjekar and lyrics Mahipal. May be only one of its kind.

85 AK July 14, 2016 at 5:35 am

Mr Rangan,
There is a slip. Paanv lagun kar jori re – you have reversed the lyricist and the MD.

86 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 14, 2016 at 11:05 am

D P Rangan ji,

Mahipal chandra Bhandari was a popular actor, but he wrote Lyrics for 4 films.
Mali-44
Aapki sewa mein-47
Adalat-48 and
Mere Laal-4.
Please note he NEVER composed any songs and Datta Davjekar,MD NEVER wrote Lyrics.

Shalal Lal ji,

Yes, he is the same Mahipal-Hero in about 150 Mythological, stunt and Costume films.
AK ji has given the correct title of Lata song.

-AD

87 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 14, 2016 at 11:06 am

* Mere Laal-48.

88 D P Rangan July 14, 2016 at 4:40 pm

Arunkumarji

I wrote from what I observed and it must have been a mistake committed by the party. I saw the position of MD and lyrist inter changed and hence wrote in that vein. I freely admit to my mistake.
There is need to check and double check sources.

89 Shalan Lal July 15, 2016 at 3:30 pm

With reference to the above discussion I now have thelyric of thesaid song:
पा लागूँ कर जोरी रे
श्याम मोसे ना खेलो होरी
हो श्याम मोसे ना खेलो होरी
पा लागूँ कर जोरी रे
श्याम मोसे ना खेलो होरी ”
मेरे श्याऽ ऽ ऽ ऽ म
मेरे श्याऽ ऽ ऽ ऽ म
मोसे ना खेलो होरी
करत जोराजोरी जोरी हो श्याम मोसे
मोसे ना खेलो होरी
छीन झपट मोरे हाथ से गागर
हाँ ऽ ऽ ऽ
छीन झपट मोरे हाथ से गागर
तोड़ के बैयाँ मरोड़ी
हाँ हाँ हाँ हाँ बैयाँ मरोड़ी
दिल धरकत है, साँस चढ़त है -२
देह काँपत गोरी गोरी
हाँ हाँ हाँ देह काँपत गोरी गोरी
हो श्याम मोसे ना खेलो होरी -२
मोसे ना खेलो होरी रे श्याम -२
मोसे ना खेलो
मोसे खेलो ना श्याम -२
मोसे ना खेलो -२
मोसे ना खेलो होरी
ना खेलो होरी

There is no in the word ‘पा’ at the start of the lyri.

It looks Mahipaal was very accomplishe lyric writer and it is sad that he did not carried on his talent further.

The singing of Lata at ehr debut showed her command on classical tune. She was twelve years old. But according to the DP’s list she must be very young when she sang her first song in the Marathi film. I think she was a “Child Prodigy”. and a great artists all the way until middles of seventees.

Shalan Lal

90 D P Rangan July 20, 2016 at 5:19 pm

https://weather.com/news/trending/video/treasure-trove-of-new-planets-found

Came across this interesting piece of news while trawling through the weather.com, which gives precise idea of weather around the locality.

91 Arunkumar Deshmukh July 20, 2016 at 5:50 pm

D P Rangan ji,

I fail to understand how this totally irrelevant information can fit here. I do not find it anyway-even by far stretched imagination- connected with music or songs of any era.
I think this may be more suitable for inclusion in “open forum”, at best.

-AD

92 D P Rangan July 21, 2016 at 2:01 am

Arunkumarji

Your point well taken. I just posted it as a continuation of my introductory post. I have no idea how to go about it in the Open Forum. How do you access it. I do not post any songs in the comments section and leave it to other veterans. I fully appreciate your view point.

93 AK July 21, 2016 at 5:38 am

Mr Rangan,
At the top of the post are three links: the middle link is “Open House”.

94 Praveen July 21, 2016 at 12:58 pm

Wonderful post. For someone like me, more into enjoying songs than analysing this is a treasure trove of ‘starry’ songs. Have just listened to the original 14. Yet to get to the rest posted by Ashwinji, Bhatiaji, Siddarthji and others.

It seems Golden era lyricists were more enamoured more by sitare than chaand, looking at the list of songs

Thanks Ranganji and AKji for the treat

95 Shalan Lal July 21, 2016 at 2:30 pm

Praveen and ksbhatia and others who take in Western songs.

Praveen’s mentioned the word “Starry” triggered the following song on Vincent Van Gogh’s life

The song has mantion of his many paintings and also his mental health issue.
The song was on th etop of thehit parade in 1971 both in England and America.

You can listen it on YT or internet. It is very wonderful.

The beiginning of the song reminds the song Saari Saari Raat Teri Yaad Menein” from Aji Bas Shukriya.

Starry Starry Night
songer writer Don McLean

Starry, Starry night
Paint your palette blue and grey

Look out on a summer’s day
With eyes that know the
Darkness in my soul.
Shadows on the hills
Sketch the trees and the daffodils

Catch the breeze and the winter chills

In colors on the snowy linen land.
And now I understand what you tried to say to me

How you suffered for your sanity
How you tried to set them free.
They would not listen
They did not know how

Perhaps they’ll listen now.

96 D P Rangan July 21, 2016 at 4:28 pm

Praveenji

Welcome to SoY. Many thanks for appreciation of the post. While songs are the heart of the post, I try to write on the subject for the general knowledge of followers. Astro physics is a great subject to study. Do listen to other songs.

97 ksbhatia August 14, 2016 at 2:44 pm

D P Rangan ji;
Can’t resist your beautiful chand/ taare songs again and again . I am refreshing with the one of the rarest song of Lata ji from an old slightly unknown film….Char Paise …by the unknown music director….B D Burman. …..but what a song !! Just listen and enjoy to your heart content.

Majhee meri naiya ko jee chhahe le chal…..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohdoSUH2OAg

There are five or six songs from this film and all are worth listening again and again . I am not sure wheather B D Burman has given music for any other movie.

98 D P Rangan August 14, 2016 at 5:39 pm

Bhatiaji

Where were you hiding all these days. What a sweet song you have posted. Please post more songs on this theme whenever you come across a new one, which should be difficult now. I have made a compendium of all the songs you had posted. This song could double as a Chand post too.

99 Jignesh Kotadia August 16, 2016 at 2:55 pm

what a nice collection of stars DPRanganji !!
i had not heard “Doob gaye aakash ke taare” yet..
but once i clicked on the YT link….i went on to hear it multiple times…..what a gem what a melody with too good picturisation !!
kitna sukoon kitna aaram hai, in Talat’s velvetty voice..he was certainly the prince of golden era.

100 Jignesh Kotadia August 16, 2016 at 3:10 pm

डुब गए आकाश के तारे, जाके न तुम आए
तकते तकते नैना हारे, जाके न तुम आए

रुठ गई बागों से बहारे, फैल गऐ पतझड के साये
लेकिन तुम को अपने वादे भुले से भी याद न आए
डुब गए…

बहते बहते चांद की कश्ती, दूर गगन में खोने लगी
आस की एक नन्ही सी किरन थी, वो भी ओझल होने लगी
डुब गए आकाश के तारे।

waah saahir..poetry at it’s top

101 D P Rangan August 16, 2016 at 6:28 pm

Jigneshji at last you surfaced on this blog. Thanks for your appreciation. The song you mentioned was part of a Talat Mahmood songs released by HMV as a casette more than 40 years ago. In those days it was a great effort to get old songs. I got all casettes digitalised by hard work and built up my mp3. collection when You Tube was far in future.

102 Jignesh Kotadia August 17, 2016 at 12:55 am

Gaddeswarupji @17
the original lines are :

kis tarah bhulega dil unka khayaal aaya hua
jaa nahin sakta abhi sheeshe men baal aaya hua

it means : during the process of glass making if a hair piece gets locked in solidified glass, then it is impossible to remove …the only way .. u have to destroy the glass.

103 Jignesh Kotadia August 17, 2016 at 1:20 am

Bhatiaji @97
i think he is VD Varman, MD of Char Paise 1955
yes, all songs are stunning ! esp all of Lata.
i had posted links of some of this film’s songs in 1955 female songs post in 2013.
idk anything abt VDVarman, Arunji may tell more abt him surely.

similarly you may amaze if u listen the songs of CHINGAARI and DO DULHE from the same year…exceptional music by Manohar and BSKalla.

These all are quite unknown artists but the results are A1 quality music.. striking feature of 50’s..whoever be the MD..no matters..music would be everlasting.

i have read somewhere abt Manohar that later he made pair with Omi (his nephew ?)as Sonik-Omi..not sure.
Over To ARUNJI.

104 Jignesh Kotadia August 17, 2016 at 1:37 am

DPRanganji
reading ur fabulous post…pehli 15 minute to aisa laga ki is antariksh journey men koi gaane baane aayenge ya nahin ?? 🙂 🙂 ya direct kisi star ke kisi planet par apni landing hogi !?

but later the melodic stars showered in abundance by u and our proficient SoY members.
enjoyed fully ur astronomy and melodies…wonderful.

105 D P Rangan August 17, 2016 at 7:20 pm

Jignesh

Thanks for the over generous appreciation. I just wrote what struck me. AK did his magic and the post emerged. Our erstwhile music directors were so versatile, you can get a song on any theme. I have already attempted on 4 diverse themes. May be others can also do even better than me not handicapped by inability to fully understand the meanings of the lyrics of a song. I will have a look at Chingaari songs.

106 mumbaikar8 August 17, 2016 at 8:28 pm

Jignesh @102
Is it ?
jaa nahin sakta abhi or Jaa nahin sakta “Kabhi “, which make more sense.
I think it is quite audible in Zohra bai’s version
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUb7JoU0pKY&feature=youtu.be

107 ksbhatia August 17, 2016 at 10:55 pm

Jignesh ji @103 ;
The movie ….char paise….is available on Y.T and I have checked up its titles . The MD is really B D Burman . Further checking over Google and other sites I am surprised that he gave music for only one film and as you also observed all the songs are a real class of mid 50 s songs which i think belong to all the new emerging MDs of that time. Beside Manohar and B S Kalla other MD like S D Batish was not far behind. It was diffecult to differentiate his music and songs from those of OPN .

Here is a sampler….Asha…..Mahfil rangeen hai……film [?]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiJVIQUTShA

108 ksbhatia August 17, 2016 at 11:03 pm

…..in continuation…..

This one is more appropriate from the same film Saazaish by Asha ji….Yun Na dekho meri jaan…..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cm4Imrkx7M

109 Jignesh Kotadia August 18, 2016 at 12:14 am

@ Mumbaikar8ji
this is interesting…
heard Zohrabai version first time…i liked it very much..thanks for the link.

both versions have different words,
i have a very clear mp3 audio of Noorjehan version and she is definitely singing ABHI,
And in
Zohrabai version there is clearly KABHI.

my view,
if she uses ‘abhi’..she applies this scientific fact to her own suffering. If she uses ‘kabhi’..she teaches this fact to the world..here our heroine has no intense to teach the scientific philosophy to people but exhibit her own pain..so i think Abhi is more relevent here.

want your views.

110 Jignesh Kotadia August 18, 2016 at 12:30 am

@ Bhatiaji
both Asha-SDBatish songs r gems.
yun na dekho meri jaan has clear OPN effect…one cant believe that this one is not OPN creation !

Mehfil rangeen hai..is from film “Tipu Sultan”.

111 Jignesh Kotadia August 18, 2016 at 1:13 am

@Mumbaikar8ji
i have checked the other versions of Kis Tarha Bhulega by various singers on YT. Most are singing “Kabhi” and only 2 are Abhi.
Later i heard the Noorjehan version many times with headphone and i came to the conclusion that she is also pronunciating Kabhi with very dull “K” that it seems almost Abhi ! It is very difficult sometimes to catch some words without earplugs and hefty attention.

yes, as u said Kabhi is well suited linguistically.

112 mumbaikar8 August 18, 2016 at 4:14 am

Jignesh,
I checked with few sites before listening to Zohra bai version, all of them write it as abhi and not kabhi.
Abhi did not make much sense to me, that is why I continued listening, when I listened to Zohra bai version it is very distinctly kabhi and not abhi.
I am glad you agree with me.

113 Siddharth August 20, 2016 at 1:34 pm

Jignesh, Mumbaikar8ji,
I think the word kabhi make more sense, it also sound like that.
I am more surprised by the second line …sheeshe mein baal aaya hua.
Could it be sheeshe mein bal (like a crack in glass because of force) and since the singers are of punjabi accent, they could have pronounced it as baal. Just speculating..

That reminds me of another Noorjehan song –
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-dKElgKGpM
Song-Tu kaun si badli mein mere chaand hai aa jaa (Khandaan)(1942) Singer-Noorjahaan, Lyrics-D N Madhok, MD-Ghulam Haider

In this also, the second line –
taare hain mere zakhm-e-jigar in mein samaa jaa

I remember having heard somewhere that DN Madhok wrote-
Taaze hain mere zakhm-e-jigar
Since, there is a minute difference in the way taare and taaze are written in urdu, Noorjehan sang it as Taare. The song was an instant hit so it was not possible to correct it later.

114 Jignesh Kotadia August 20, 2016 at 11:49 pm

Siddharthji
thanks for coming in this vague lyrics solution debate.
you maybe right.
other experts are also invited to help.

this ghazal is an unusual one.
in मत्ला, poet sets Kaafiya at ख़याल , बाल and Radeef at आया हुआ. To maintain this kaafiya-radeef pair, in antaras’ saani misras should have lines like भूचाल आया हुआ, बैताल आया हुआ, अकाल आया हुआ etc.

but, in Antaras he shifts the kaafiya place to आया, भाया, खाया..!!

so, i think there is no solid requirement to pronunciate “bal” to “baal”..bcz that place is not the permanant kaafiya place.

आगे की वलीसाहब जाने…

there is one more googly in this lyrics,
the second antara : o chaman se door bulbul jaake roye…roye **saath saath** !

is it Saath Saath or any other word ? i could not distinguish.

115 mumbaikar8 August 21, 2016 at 5:52 am

Siddharth.
Thanks for lending in your views.
My thought on ja nahin sakta kabhi sheeshe me baal aaya hua is literally “hair stuck in mirror while moulding cannot be undone”.
My take on taare hai mere zakhme jigar in me samaja is that (I cannot translate it in a poetic way, AK or Anu can do it) “ zakhme jigar are my prized possession you come and be subsumed”
This is my interpretation, as Jignesh said experts are welcomed.

Jignesh,
It is not o chaman but Aa chaman se door bulbul jake roye, roye saath saath
Does it make sense now?

116 Jignesh Kotadia August 21, 2016 at 9:19 am

Siddharthji
if there are Chand and Badli, then there could be Taare..taare makes the verse Poetic..as Mumbaikarji said.
if there is Taaze…then the verse must be : taaze hain mere zakhme jigar is ko mita jaa … isnt !?

but
Mumbaikarji
this line is still Out Of My Understanding :
despite ur editing i cudnt clear it in my mind…must be my fault. Doesnt it show a grammatic mismatch between both lines !?
आ चमन से दूर बुलबुल जाके रोये..रोये साथ साथ
तेरा दिल भी चोट है मेरी तरह खाया हुआ

117 AK August 21, 2016 at 10:25 am

Mumbaikar8, Jignesh, Siddharth,
I have been following your discussion on the two lyrics with interest.

In जा नहीं सकता कभी/अभी शीशे में बाल आया हुआ, Zohrabai’s version is clear ‘kabhi’, there may be some doubt in Noorjehan’s. I would take it ‘kabhi’ as it makes perfect sense: “A hair entrapped in a moulded glass can never go away.”

आ(ज) चमन से दूर बुलबुल जाके रोए साथ साथ – The nightingale is equally sad being deserted by her lover. But shedding tears together might be awkward for both. Therefore, she goes away from the garden and cries in unison with the lady at their common grief.

तू कौन सी बदली में मेरे चांद है आ जा
तारे(ज़े) हैं मेरे…

I don’t know what DN Madhok intended. But “taare” makes perfect sense.
“In which cloud you have hidden yourself O moon.
The wounds of my heart are like stars, come out and merge yoursef in these.”

I am translating “jigar” as heart, I find liver clumsy here.

118 mumbaikar8 August 21, 2016 at 4:11 pm

AK,
Thanks for living up to my expectations!
Perhaps the interpretation of analogy “Taare hai mere zakhme jigar” different?

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